[Hplusroadmap] Fwd: [ExI] Bootstrapping a singularity (not-essay) (was Re: MAX MORE in Second Life yesterday)

[Jim Hardy]

Bryan,

Point #1:  Look for Womack & Jones:  "Lean Thinking" and "The Machine that
Changed the World.  These are good books, and they strive for perfection.
Also, any book by W. Edwards Deming
[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/W._Edwards_Deming] is amazing.

Point #2:" It's unfortunate that the energy collection process you mention,
there, 
would be limited to the available silica scraps -- meaning it's 
ultimately tied up to the economics behind it all."

This has been the case since recorded history.  If you can mine silica and
convert it at lower cost, so be it.  Please find another source, like
focused solar rays.  I will tell you that I worked with an old guy who did
work with the Manhattan Project in the 40's at the University of Rochester.
They employed a series of magnifying glasses to focus sunlight to a pin
sized lesions to sear pi g flesh (strapped in a harness, naturally) to study
in gory detail the effects of ionizing radiation on flesh.  Not to produce
massive energy sources, but this is not a new idea.

And the human brain, long thought to be developed in early childhood and
thereafter degenerate, has recently (within the past 15 years) been
theorized to be continuously developing through mechanisms not yet
understood, but theoretically involving cascading regulatory systems
involving swapping of neural synapses stimulated by environmental inputs.
Learned behavior, in a sense.  The human body is still the most
sophisticated computer known to mankind.  The only system we know of (which
is being quite silly because any mammal is in the fold), which continuously
monitors their environment at changes that environment to be more favorable
towards their sustenance.  We are a long ways from understanding how to
build a computer that can do this.  We first need to understand how we are
able to do it.

Jim H



-----Original Message-----
From: hplusroadmap-bounces at heybryan.org
[mailto:hplusroadmap-bounces at heybryan.org] On Behalf Of Bryan Bishop
Sent: Friday, June 13, 2008 9:38 PM
To: Transhumanist Technical Roadmap
Subject: Re: [Hplusroadmap] Fwd: [ExI] Bootstrapping a singularity
(not-essay) (was Re: MAX MORE in Second Life yesterday)

On Friday 13 June 2008, Jim Hardy wrote:
> Bryan,

Hey Jim. [see my last email to you, first]

> I am amazed and impressed to hear you talking about "manufacturing
> processes".   Having observed and worked to improve these relics over
> the past 20 years, there are a few processes that are pretty good
> (most of them focused around principles established as a part of the
> Toyota Production system in the 1940's by Americans working to
> rebuild a nation utterly destroyed by WWII), but most are flawed.
>  Flawed not to an extent that would cause financial ruin:  flawed to
> the extent that they are convenient for making a few lucky ones
> wealthy, but never aspiring to perfection.

I have an important question to ask you. I spent a few hours today 
rummaging through a used books store looking at all of the civil 
engineering, mechanical engineering, drafting, and other such books. By 
all I mean all. There was at least a few hundred textbooks there. None 
of these books had information on these relics to the scope that would 
be required to actually implement a new manufacturing process for some 
new material, or some new design, or something. It's very, very weird, 
and I'm wondering what the secret is -- is there some book that does 
this? Or is this just something passed down by Oral Tradition? I'm 
thinking that the majority of industrialization, done between 1850 and 
1970~ perhaps, was when this information would have been available, but 
now I'm not seeing much of an introduction for novitiates to take 
advantage of. I suspect the knowledge might be tied up in the 
professional societies, but I'm not entirely sure. Any hints?

> Old silly systems indeed dominate.  The FDA is the epitome of this
> notion. Having lead engineering groups at a major Solar Panel
> producer (all to make others wealthy), silica scrap from chip
> production can be converted to a product which yields energy (in the
> form of a flow of electrons collected in a diode and then directed to
> produce current) could indeed be directed to be to be self sustaining
> and ultimately self perpetuating in whatever form.

It's unfortunate that the energy collection process you mention, there, 
would be limited to the available silica scraps -- meaning it's 
ultimately tied up to the economics behind it all. That's very 
unfortunate -- otherwise I'm pretty sure the tech is already known and 
available, and a lot of people are working on it to make it 'cheaper', 
which is financial concerns, even though we most definitely have tons 
of available resources for making it happen. 

> But I do need to point out that this assumption is inaccurate: "The
> human brain is instantiated with a species-typical upper limit on
> computing power and loses neurons as it ages."
>
> The humans brain is not losing computing power between the ages of
> approximately birth until at least the mid 50's.  Consider how this
> changes your conclusions.

[See the last email on that.]

- Bryan
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